Falling Toward Apotheosis | For the Second Time

[0:47] Welcome to Babylon 5 for the second time. My name is Brent Allen. My name is Jeff Akin. Brent and I used to be Star Trek podcasters, and then we watched Babylon 5 for the first time, and everything changed. So now we're watching this incredible series for the second time because Babylon 5 is a series that you get to watch for the first time twice.

[1:15] That's right. But we're also, for the first, second time, whatever, watching the show for the messages that are contained within. What are the things that we pluck out of it? Maybe what are some things that JMS himself intended, not just what we speculate, but what the man himself is saying. We're looking for things that hold up a mirror to society, give us hope that things can be better in the future. Or maybe they just tell us how to be better human beings to one another.

[1:41] That being said, this is Jeff and mine's second time through the series. We have watched it all the way through once. Spoiler free, we had no idea what was coming next. Had an entire run. This is not that. That means that anything from any point in the timeline, in the franchise, in-universe, out-of-universe, doesn't matter. It is all fair game for Jeff and I to talk about. So this is your one and only spoiler warning. If you have not watched this incredible show for the first time for yourself, stop this show right now. Go join our first watch. Just scroll up in the feed. It'll be up that way somewhere. And you can do that spoiler free. And then once you're through the show first, you come back and do this one. Because trust me, it's a different watch the second time around. It's like the first time, but it's still a different watch. So that being said, you have been warned. My warning is sincere. Ignore it at your own peril. Brant, this week we're watching an episode called Falling Toward Apotheosis. When we watch this the first time, we would predict what the next episode was going to be. based on the title alone, what did you predict falling toward apotheosis was going to be about?

[2:46] Well, apotheosis reminded me of the word apotheosis.

[2:49] Apostasy. Apostasy means to leave the faith. And so I said this would be the one about the Vorlons leaving the faith, or rather the younger races leaving the faith of the Vorlon as we begin to realize that they are not the force for good that we've been led to believe that they are. I don't remember if that actually happens in this particular episode or not, Jeff, but I then went on to say this. I would like to quote, or maybe they weren't ever really a force for good. Maybe we just made them out to be that way or maybe they made themselves out to be that way. How about that prediction? Hope nobody drove off the road when they heard me say that. Mostly from going, yeah, they said it back in Zaha Doom. What are you doing? How about you, Jeff? I really thought we were going to see two kind of things go on here. We were going to see, uh Londo trying to convince cartagia that the shadows aren't going to be happy being stuck with just the island they're going to want more and more land so just more of Londo trying to kind of dismantle cartagia and what he was doing and then i remember saying you know hey sheridan is meant to fight legends and what better time than now and uh i will quote here for myself he's going to go one on one with the kosh one.

[4:13] One on one with the kosh one. Which is actually the kosh two, because kosh one is inside of him. Or at least a piece. I was being the rock. I'm such a great rock. You, yeah yeah i just have a really great picture the picture of him with the the fanny pack the necklace he's all i did i did like i'll have to find it i did a side by side had a fanny pack and everything i mean really you can't tell the difference between the two of us i have seen so many people do that particular look like for halloween or something like that it's it's classic every time you do it it's so good it's amazing perfect well jeff uh that's what we predicted, Predictions are always fun, regardless if we get them right or not. But you and I did watch this one time before. Are you interested in what we actually thought once we had watched the episode? I really am. I am, too, because I'll be honest. I'm sitting here right now in this moment. I still don't know what this particular episode was about. They all jumbled together for me in this deal. So let's take a look at what we had said the first time around.

[5:20] Previously on Babylon 5 for the first time. falling towards help me out with this one jeff you got this i believe in you i believe in you apotheosis no no apotheosis i mean really how could you not love an episode that has cartagia, dusting the nose of a beheaded minister while londo sits holding his nose nose because they have to reek does he really feel like he hears voices i think he does i think he does this whole thing he's like i was talking to minister dagari here and he had this great idea that we should do this and it's like oh yeah yeah your highness that's great let's talk about londo's silver tongue we have to remember you can remember your majesty he wasn't even talking to cartagia he was talking directly to his ego.

[6:10] Plan is so brilliant it puts cartagia and londo on narn cartagia is gonna get refund man he's like if i try and kill cartagia here me and jakar will be dead in 2.2 seconds this is his kobayashi maru and he's kirking it by going in and changing the parameters of the game uh jakar's getting his eye plucked out i just imagine that guy going home his wife's like how was your day and he's like i really i really don't want to talk about it if you had to pull somebody's eye out right now what would you do i pray desperately neither you nor i ever know the answer to that question kosh one is now gone gone gone for reals and i'm kind of upset about it this exit didn't seem worthy of the of the gravity of kosh being there to me i'm really over garibaldi right now yeah what i don't know about garibaldi right now what is talking is this actually garibaldi or is this whatever psychor plopped into his head zach gets it even after he stormed out of the war council which i also get zach went after him and behind behind garibaldi's back stood up for him and i thought that was awesome so sheridan people are looking at him like he's a freaking god and he's like i don't like.

[7:22] It i don't want to be that and lorian's like you've got to be that i know.

[7:41] The way it's phrased is he walked faithfully with God, and then he was no more. And the implication being that he never died. He was just taken. We're closer to Sheridan becoming a god and having to leave his brand new wife and probably his new baby. I don't think we're going to see baby David on this show. And you're right. We're not going to see baby David in this show. Or grown David. Or grown David. We're not going to see David. We're going to hear his name. Yep. He's going to be talked about. uh sheridan must be a god yeah i don't remember that conversation no yeah i remember the whole thing lorian being like this you have to embrace this this has to be your thing yeah i don't i don't i'm interested to see that also uh here's what i'm excited then just after coming off of that is we get we get to see the 20-year thing the birth of it right yeah um and i i've still got a, few uh i i got a few questions about where it gets set up and how it comes and and what's the what with how it's supposed to work so i'm interested to see this time around knowing what happens i can i can be looking for it so i liked our discussion on the uh and then he is no more because even when we get to sleeping in light it's just he stopped.

[9:01] That's it. Just, yeah. Boop. So planting the seed for you. I mean, you guys correct me if I'm wrong. There was no body. He just went. Just went. Yeah. I think that is correct. So what do you say we dive into this one? Yes. I would like that very much. All right. Very good. Very good. We're about to dive into this episode literally right here. We're going to pull it up and we're going to watch it together with you. We'll talk about our responses to things, reactions to things, any messages that come up during the episode itself, we cut that up and edit it into a reaction-style video for YouTube. If you want the full and the unedited version of it, you can see that a week ahead of the normal releases at our Patreon page, which is patreon.com slash badnerds. And if you're listening to the audio podcasting app, you're going to hear that reaction, and then we're going to meet you on the other side where we will share our thoughts and talk about messages that we uncover. So, Jeff, let's go watch an episode. Let's fall towards it. Accessing file. Oh, no. We're preempting your normal Babcom service to bring you another update. Right now, our greatest enemy is fear.

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